singaporean siding with angmoh when bullying another sgp.
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ever encountered such situation? dunno why i suddenly rmb this incident - make my blood boil. once, in holland v, i saw sort of a fight in carpark.
i saw a fellow ctyman waiting for a lot .. he signalled, and patiently waited for the other driver to pull out. even wave to that other drive to let him know to take his time. then, as soon as that other driver pulled out, this angmoh drove against the flow of traffic (as you know, holland v must follow a "rectangle"), and head first into the lot. of course, our fellow ctyman got out the car and started "X!@))($)(!@$)(!@$)(!@)($*!@$)*!@)$!@*)$*". the angmoh charboh, "yea yea so what?". i can understand that sometimes this angmohs think they damn big, come in think we easy bully .. but what really got me was her friend, a sgporean girl, who came out and, "hey, big man, stopped throwing a hissy fit". they then walked off.
of course the poor guy can't do siht - whack go jail, vandalise go jail .. so he ended up going off - think he too pissed.
damn sickening behavior. i spent most of my life in australia although i'm sgporean .. but i'm full on sgporean and proudly so .. i think being a minority there made me cling on to my roots very tightly, so tightly that i came back to the motherland for NS. how can people just turn their backs on their fellow ctymen who has done no wrong? that's just fucked up. i know some ppl will say that girl stnad by her friend only .. but how can just do such a thing when that guy did no wrong? SPG?
i also realised that in australia, alot of sgporeans who have "aussie" accents (i say "aussie" because it's obviously not native) despite only living here for 2 yrs (1/9th me)). but even weirder is that in singapore, alot of people (esp. professional girls) with fake accents .. netiher aussie, yankee or british. how come?
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Hm, I do somewhat understand where you're coming from.
But turning xenophobic in Australia isn't going to help.
Example:
I can't stand ang mohs who come to Singapore, happily enjoy Singapore culture, low tax, higher pay, better treatment, only to turn around and bitch and whinge and moan about how "bad" Singapore is and how "bad" Singaporeans are. Yup, you're earning money in Singapore, some have become PRs and happily raking in the benefits of being PR, and still moan, gripe, bitch and whinge.
I mean, if you don't like it in Singapore, why are you here? I'll bet back in wherever they came from, they wouldn't earn even half of what they earn in Singapore by virtue of just being white.
No one is asking them to embrace Singapore and walk out with their faces painted in the colours of the SG flag, but at least show some bloody respect. The lack of shame or humility being in a country, earning your livelihood which you left your country because it couldn't provide for you and turning around and bitching about it is not only annoying, lacks maturity, respect and a lack of cultivated, civilised upbringing.......
If that ang moh woman was at fault, yes, I agree, her friend should have rebuked her or at least set her aside and explained to her. But Singapore itself is plagued by fellow Singaporeans who believe that anything white has the privilege of being treated like God incarnate.
Ang mohs, or any other race, I'd expect, would gladly take to this sort of remote 'apatheid' treatment like ducks to water. I mean, if a bunch of people treated you like a King, wouldn't you happily accept it? Its only so long before even the most humble of persons would give up and start letting that preferential treatment get to him/her.
Plus, your 'aussie accent' accusation to all Singaporeans, I think, is a little far-fetched. Yes, there are those who 'act slang' or 'posers' but who cares? If they want to make fools out of themselves, let them! Why should we feel compelled to act unless they were putting themselves or others in danger or something.
Also, many Singaporeans I know don't speak very 'Singlish'-like but have pretty neutral accents. Its just how they were brought up to speak, encouraged by schools, family, etc. Who knows?
In my school, we were encouraged to speak 'good english'. Singlish, or overly exaggerated intonations were frowned upon. It was a good 6 - 7 years of being taught to speak in a neutral tone with no inclination to any particular ang moh accent but just with an emphasis on speaking 'good english', apply it to everyday life just because 'practice makes perfect'.
Later, as I transitioned into other schools, I learnt to loosen up, learnt to allow myself leeway into a more open form of English because after all, its a form of communication not a bloody science! But I had to learn it.Could you then say I deliberately 'act slang'? I really doubt so.
I always believed that you have to learn to hate a country to love it. That's because you open your eyes to its flaws (FOBs tend to just glaze over the bad things and paint happy happy things about the country because they're so star-struck by being in a new, foreign land) before learning to accept it and grow a desire to want to change it.
Just like in Singapore. And Australia.
In the same way, you wrapping yourself so tightly in a ethnic and racial, for the lack of a better word, clingwrap, only suffocates your perception and judgement of Australia, Australians, and might I dare say, Singapore and Singaporeans.
Open your eyes, enjoy Australia, and embrace it. If you think that being a minority here makes you xenophobic - imagine how the ethnic minorities in Singapore feel?Take it as a learning curve, and not take things at such face value.
In fact, from my 360 degree, directionless response I'm sure you realise that I too am quite conflicted on this matter as well, both for the empathy of what you heard happened in SG and then the dismay that you shut yourself off the enjoyment of Australia and the people.
Maybe you can do something by applying what you've learnt in your everyday life. Learn to appreciate your fellow Singaporean and Australian, etc, etc.
And if you see any injustice, stand up and speak out. I mean, I think that's the whole point of your rant, isn't it?
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good post, and much veracity in your arguments. btw i actually grew up in australia, but i'm now in singapore. so i don't think it's fair to say i'm xenophobic given that i attended a private grade sch, junior/senior high; most of my mates are either white, anglo somehow (have an "indian-looking" friend, who is by blood 75% british), or deluded into believing they are white .. oh, and most recently, thanks to the all-bullshit approach of mass media, black (you know what's a chinese wannabe blackguy? a chigga. - i swear it's the dumbest thing i've ever heard in my life) :P
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it just might be that the "neutral" accent you speak of, is what i consider to be "fake". all things considered, i am accustomed to the aussie accent, and what singaporeans i meet i identify by their unique manner of speech. so whenever i come across a singaporean who speaks without the "exaggerated intonation" it strikes me as odd. singapore is a small country, and people do not live in bubbles - how can it be that someone is absolutely free of the national sharps/flats/upshifts/downshifts in speech, unless they are making a conscious effort to avoid any subconscious reversion into what is undeniably the natural way of tihngs in singapore?
it is this conscious effort that i absolurely abhor, whether in the context of talking or beyond. nationalism and globalisation are not, and do not have to be, mutually exclusive. hence, my previous rant - that the sg girl (forthwith, "dumbass-SPG") took the side of the ang moh (forthwith, "FOB-in-SGP") after the ang moh blatantly asserted her right to the lot, against the principles of natural justice, to the detriment of her fellow citizen. whilst i see that my point rests on shaky foudations which are open to attacks of, "dumbass-SPG is siding with FOB-in-SGP, not because FOB-in-SGP is white, but because FOB-in-SGP is dumbass-SPG's friend", i feel that had the FOB-in-SGP been just another singaporean, dumbass-SPG would not have allowed such behaviour, much less take the side and defend her friend (let's face it - in this day and age, how many irrational people are there in Singapore? few).
p.s.: speak out at injustice? words have no effect on those who choose not to hear.
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maybe sgp gal not siding with angmoh b'cos he's angmoh...but she's siding him b'cos he's her friend?? sometimes, don't read too much into things....
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Originally posted by lostintransition:
maybe sgp gal not siding with angmoh b'cos he's angmoh...but she's siding him b'cos he's her friend?? sometimes, don't read too much into things....
please read all posts before posting. -_- -
Originally posted by jaezai2008:
good post, and much veracity in your arguments. btw i actually grew up in australia, but i'm now in singapore. so i don't think it's fair to say i'm xenophobic given that i attended a private grade sch, junior/senior high; most of my mates are either white, anglo somehow (have an "indian-looking" friend, who is by blood 75% british), or deluded into believing they are white .. oh, and most recently, thanks to the all-bullshit approach of mass media, black (you know what's a chinese wannabe blackguy? a chigga. - i swear it's the dumbest thing i've ever heard in my life) :P
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it just might be that the "neutral" accent you speak of, is what i consider to be "fake". all things considered, i am accustomed to the aussie accent, and what singaporeans i meet i identify by their unique manner of speech. so whenever i come across a singaporean who speaks without the "exaggerated intonation" it strikes me as odd. singapore is a small country, and people do not live in bubbles - how can it be that someone is absolutely free of the national sharps/flats/upshifts/downshifts in speech, unless they are making a conscious effort to avoid any subconscious reversion into what is undeniably the natural way of tihngs in singapore?
it is this conscious effort that i absolurely abhor, whether in the context of talking or beyond. nationalism and globalisation are not, and do not have to be, mutually exclusive. hence, my previous rant - that the sg girl (forthwith, "dumbass-SPG") took the side of the ang moh (forthwith, "FOB-in-SGP") after the ang moh blatantly asserted her right to the lot, against the principles of natural justice, to the detriment of her fellow citizen. whilst i see that my point rests on shaky foudations which are open to attacks of, "dumbass-SPG is siding with FOB-in-SGP, not because FOB-in-SGP is white, but because FOB-in-SGP is dumbass-SPG's friend", i feel that had the FOB-in-SGP been just another singaporean, dumbass-SPG would not have allowed such behaviour, much less take the side and defend her friend (let's face it - in this day and age, how many irrational people are there in Singapore? few).
p.s.: speak out at injustice? words have no effect on those who choose not to hear.
I smiled at the P.S part. You're right, words fall upon deaf ears, esp those who lack the mental/moral capacity or at least, the balls to stand up for what's right.
I see, so that's why you are so protective of the 'Singaporean' identity thing. Because you spent so much of your life here. That's understandable.
(yes, I'm a very motherly young woman who sounds like an old fart.)
Hehe, I've heard of the 'Chigga' thing and I agree it sounds very silly.
In fact, a friend of mine thought he invented that word when he kept calling every Chinese guy he saw wearing anything remotely stereotypically 'Black' a 'Chigga'.About the accent.
I'm a little confused. Following your logic my entire school's philosophy towards the usage of the English would be 'pretentious' as well?
I have no qualms speaking in normal Singaporean sounding English, in fact I find it much more expressive than what I was brought up with (not trying to sound all haughty and distance myself from anything, but my entire family, save for my sister and brother who went through the same schooling as I did, speaks in gratifying Singlish.).
In fact, I sound a bit funny because I've been told I'm not 'Singaporean' sounding enough, like its my fault.
Besides, as I've said, its a form of communication, not a science, so I think we tend to get too deeply into the whole 'who sounds Singaporean and who doesn't' as though our entire identity depended on how 'Singaporean' we sound.
With all due respect, I do appreciate how strongly you feel about the SG identity, even going for (!) NS, but perhaps your feelings of abhorrence could be better directed towards Singaporeans who as much as possible, deny everything Singaporean about themselves and distance themselves from the whole Singaporean identity like it granted them some higher form of social stature.
Btw, I'm curious as to the circumstances of why you left?
Was it family? Or did you just didn't feel you belonged in Australia?
Just for the fun of it...I'm guessing you are around your early 20's?
Hehe, I liked how you sounded so Singaporean in the first post when you were in rant mode, then in reply to my post you reverted to debate mode.
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I think you're reading too much into this. I've seen parking-space disputes that involve two Singaporean drivers, and the passengers in the offending party's car did not step up to set things right either. It's not a Singaporean-versus-foreigner issue here - it's just that one side chosses to make obnoxious jackasses of themselves.
As for the fake-accent issue, well, some people just seem to have self-image problems. It always makes me cringe when I hear Singaporeans affect what they imagine to be some accent or other and accompany it with Singlish grammar. It's simply not a good look.
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Originally posted by GameGoddess:
I smiled at the P.S part. You're right, words fall upon deaf ears, esp those who lack the mental/moral capacity or at least, the balls to stand up for what's right.
I see, so that's why you are so protective of the 'Singaporean' identity thing. Because you spent so much of your life here. That's understandable.
(yes, I'm a very motherly young woman who sounds like an old fart.)
Hehe, I've heard of the 'Chigga' thing and I agree it sounds very silly. In fact, a friend of mine thought he invented that word when he kept calling every Chinese guy he saw wearing anything remotely stereotypically 'Black' a 'Chigga'.About the accent.
I'm a little confused. Following your logic my entire school's philosophy towards the usage of the English would be 'pretentious' as well?
I have no qualms speaking in normal Singaporean sounding English, in fact I find it much more expressive than what I was brought up with (not trying to sound all haughty and distance myself from anything, but my entire family, save for my sister and brother who went through the same schooling as I did, speaks in gratifying Singlish.).
In fact, I sound a bit funny because I've been told I'm not 'Singaporean' sounding enough, like its my fault.
Besides, as I've said, its a form of communication, not a science, so I think we tend to get too deeply into the whole 'who sounds Singaporean and who doesn't' as though our entire identity depended on how 'Singaporean' we sound.
With all due respect, I do appreciate how strongly you feel about the SG identity, even going for (!) NS, but perhaps your feelings of abhorrence could be better directed towards Singaporeans who as much as possible, deny everything Singaporean about themselves and distance themselves from the whole Singaporean identity like it granted them some higher form of social stature.
Btw, I'm curious as to the circumstances of why you left?
Was it family? Or did you just didn't feel you belonged in Australia?
Just for the fun of it...I'm guessing you are around your early 20's?
Hehe, I liked how you sounded so Singaporean in the first post when you were in rant mode, then in reply to my post you reverted to debate mode.yes, you're right. an intelligent guess. i am in my early 20s. i was born in sgp, but family uprooted when i was 3 (parents both in MNC; job relocation), stayed in australia till i turned 18, returned for NS and ... if i say any more than this, anyone with sufficient time on their hands would be able to sniff me out - and depending on how they take to what i've said whilst hiding behind my avatar, either punch me, or punch me. lol. don't get me wrong, i like australia, but i like singapore better :) like sg city, sg women, sg food .. in essense, they really are the one and the same.
and u & gedanken are right - i'm taking things too deeply. oh the horror! especially, in of all places, a no-focus forum in which topics/posts comprising no more than one word appear at hourly intervals. =P and i don't consider myself to operate in 2 modes - rather, when i was ranting, i was doing just that .. it's like when shit happens you go, "FUCKING CHEEBYE !@)($)(!@$)(!@$)(!@)($!)(@$)(!@" KNN". and when we were debating a substantive issue, i accorded due respect by taking it seriously.
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Originally posted by Gedanken:
I think you're reading too much into this. I've seen parking-space disputes that involve two Singaporean drivers, and the passengers in the offending party's car did not step up to set things right either. It's not a Singaporean-versus-foreigner issue here - it's just that one side chosses to make obnoxious jackasses of themselves.
As for the fake-accent issue, well, some people just seem to have self-image problems. It always makes me cringe when I hear Singaporeans affect what they imagine to be some accent or other and accompany it with Singlish grammar. It's simply not a good look.
once i saw a CNA report on blog shops .. some guy bakign cheeseckae or dunno what lanpa-cake .. the host is some ABC, speak to him funny funny accent .. the poor guy, is clearly 1000% singaporean, but he also try to sound smart, and reply him in funnier funnier accent .. i laugh until i had to go toilet make cake too
then again, rich of me to speak of other people's pretentious accents ... coz when i got nothing better to do i'll be ultra guai lan when i speak to say an indian man, whatever position he may be; whether he's my colleague, or the security guard downstairs .. i'll go, "ehhh brrrr*rolls tongue*uuuuderr ada makan?". i know he's indian and ada makan is malay, but usually he will, "ada makan boss". =D
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spit on their cars. that better than doing nothing.
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park his car directly infront of her car lo.. so the charboh cant move out.. den go out and come back collect car the next day..
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Please lah... that sg's a friend of the ang moh then of course side with ang moh lah... when did you see a friend side on stranger before?
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Originally posted by jaezai2008:
ever encountered such situation? dunno why i suddenly rmb this incident - make my blood boil. once, in holland v, i saw sort of a fight in carpark.
i saw a fellow ctyman waiting for a lot .. he signalled, and patiently waited for the other driver to pull out. even wave to that other drive to let him know to take his time. then, as soon as that other driver pulled out, this angmoh drove against the flow of traffic (as you know, holland v must follow a "rectangle"), and head first into the lot. of course, our fellow ctyman got out the car and started "X!@))($)(!@$)(!@$)(!@)($*!@$)*!@)$!@*)$*". the angmoh charboh, "yea yea so what?". i can understand that sometimes this angmohs think they damn big, come in think we easy bully .. but what really got me was her friend, a sgporean girl, who came out and, "hey, big man, stopped throwing a hissy fit". they then walked off.
of course the poor guy can't do siht - whack go jail, vandalise go jail .. so he ended up going off - think he too pissed.
damn sickening behavior. i spent most of my life in australia although i'm sgporean .. but i'm full on sgporean and proudly so .. i think being a minority there made me cling on to my roots very tightly, so tightly that i came back to the motherland for NS. how can people just turn their backs on their fellow ctymen who has done no wrong? that's just fucked up. i know some ppl will say that girl stnad by her friend only .. but how can just do such a thing when that guy did no wrong? SPG?
i also realised that in australia, alot of sgporeans who have "aussie" accents (i say "aussie" because it's obviously not native) despite only living here for 2 yrs (1/9th me)). but even weirder is that in singapore, alot of people (esp. professional girls) with fake accents .. netiher aussie, yankee or british. how come?
Experience is that SPGs mostly have no sense of right or wrong. They will most likely follow their ang moh rich daddy like a cow dragged by the nose.
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Please lah... that sg's a friend of the ang moh then of course side with ang moh lah... when did you see a friend side on stranger before?
even though u know your friends at fault?
probably happen to ppl who has lost its sense of justice.
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Originally posted by reyes:
even though u know your friends at fault?
probably happen to ppl who has lost its sense of justice.
wah.. even if my friend at fault, i will pull him/her away first den say mah..
u mean to say u go out with ur friend den he at fault den infront of the stranger u tell him "hey u r in the wrong!" ah?
like that sure no friends left sia..
at most i just try to ease the situation and quickly pull my friend away..
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frankly, i will tell my friends reverse your car out la. if i know we are wrong.
i drive with common sense. dont you?
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i would have told my fren not to go in at all.. let the person go in since he was waiting..
not wait till we are outta the car with the guy ranting at us den i say 'lets go back and reverse out'.. prevention is better than cure ya..
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Better have a friend than an enemy...after all, this is Singapore
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put a fresh fish in his exhaust
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Originally posted by pigsticker:
put a fresh fish in his exhaust
Wtf...