Be Safe in investing MLM Companies/Share your experience
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I have my fair share of MLM a.k.a Pyramid System. I take you all back to 1995-1997 remember No.1 Products. I was quite young at that time and worked part time at a supermarket store earning a few hundred per week.
One of my idiot friend got me into listern to No.1 product and say about their magnatic bed have improve health functinos and stuff and count myself lucky I bought one thinking it would be good for my mom for health reason. Lucky that was during CNY and they had a rebate lucky draw and I got the $1888 draw and the bed cost was $1280 so lucky me got a bed and $600. (Suckers lost a bed and $600 to me).Being inmuture and easily psychoed I thought I got a good deal. They even gave me a cheapo members card.
Soon after I got called up for NS and stuff. 2 years down the road when I ORD my officer called me up trying to sell me another bed another company this time round I've got my experience with me and being firm in my decision. No mean No and more over I've one bed already why would I need to buy another one.
A few months ago I too had another friend that joined BEL AIR and made it... He asked me and brought me to the commonwealth place to listern I find it a baloni and BS. The speaker was a ex-DJ. No doubt his presentation was great but once bitten twice shy. So out of friendship and goodwill i got the cheapest lamp and a liquid... its still full and the lamp is unused.
Now my brother-in-law is sucked into NTI. Selling women's undergarment (Lu Mi Mi ) which by the way was sold by No.1 Products about a decade ago and where is No.1 product? Gone!!! can't be found anywhere. All these young people have no idea what business is about. Have not even step into working live and want to teach people twice their age about business. My dear brother-in-law... wake up and smell the coffee... have soemone to pay for your university fees go and study and get a good honors grade don't waste your time at NTI playing know it all and selling undergarment to old women and neglecting your studies. I have to work and pay for my own university studies and study part time so difficult and tired.
Sorry that was personal... Anyway don't admire the people having office there they are at the top of the food chain. You are at the bottom and always will be. You are working so hard so that these people can fuel their car they drive... sleep on the bed and house they buy.
Based on their model you need to have at least 20 to 30 generations of downlinks and them to have thier own to be able to have an office there and make those flowery speeches. Think how many people you need to lure into the same boat you sit in and you might not know when the boat may sink
MLM or Pyramid System companies will always be around. These companies work only on one expect of human nature "GREED" as Money is the root of all evil.
Think about it, all of these MLM companies be it NTI, No.1 Products, BEL AIR, Amway, always promise a high pay without working just recruit peoplr will do. Nice car. Nice house. Frequent Holidays to the listerners. How many of the people asking you to join have them? Why are they always so eager to "help" you succeed? Cause if you don't join they can't afford their Car...House...Holiday...or their monthly expenses.
I work in a 8am to 530pm job earning about $3500... I own a car... have platinum cards offer to me by banks but I rejected I only need one for emergencys. If I join in their crazy party I'll just have to slog out even more after work and might get nothing in return.
When I sit down to these people at these talks and psycho session I ask them a few questions
1. How long have you been doing this? (some say: 1 year or so)
2. Have you achieve a car yet? (Some reply: not yet but I'm getting there)
3. I own a car does it mean i'm more successful than you? (Common Replies: Blank Blank try to talk about something else).
4. Is your earnings taxable? (Common replies : Blank again)
5. If not taxable then in future how I apply for Credit Card? (Replies: Blank Blank again)
If you are there you can ask them these questions too listen to their reply and if they change the subject. Cause they can't convince you they will confuse you. Stay sharp and firm. You have a choice the money is in your pocket, they can't take it if you do not want to give it. If they do take without you approval its robbery. Another tactic is if they offer you goods for trial ask for a signed letter that these are free and for trial make sure it comes with a company letter head. Don't touch just see the item you never know if they will pull a fast one on you. In shopping center rules are once broken considered sold in MLM companies once touched considered sold. Like my experience in BEL AIR keep pushing things for me to buy I said NO they keep insisting and outcome walk away come back later sit down and say I only want this that and that end. Nothing more you want to give me at your own cost cause I wouldn't pay as I've no money to pay for the rest.
You people that are in MLM Companies and thinking of joining. Listen up: The only way to success is by hard work and a bit of luck. By asking people to invest 14k or 10k or what ever amount pls don't make real investers laugh...
If you really want to succeed
1. Saving 1/10 of your every monthly pay for a year or two.
2. Ask people that really succeed to help you invest. ( This is the difficult part so luck play a part to know such people and by saying that I don't mean Jackie "NTI boss" or other MLM boss. I mean those SME bosses you should look at them)
3. If not put your savings in bank that money goes in easily and take out very hard.
4. Don't be hasty in investing ask for 2nd or 3rd or 4th opinion as many as pos from people in the industry you intend to invest. (E.G. you are not going to as a pork seller if today's fish are fresh and nice right)
5. Don't regret if you invest wrongly but you must remember your mistake and learn from it and don't repeat it again.
6. But in any case if your investment does come out right make your investment's children(returns) make more childrens and make all these children create more children and make all your children(returns) work for you and in time to come 4-5yrs you will made it.
Your money is hard to earn, keep it for rainy days and opportunity that comes along. If you are not sure always remember these few things: "You are in control, Your money is YOUR MONEY, You don't owe anyone of them S**T, No means NO, Walk away and keep your money"
Be smart, stay cool you all .
Cheers
IronBandit -
Totally support u. Nice neutral + factual passage and stats.
70% of the pyramid dun earn more than 100-500.
90-95% of pyramid dun earn more than 4 digit
0.3-0.5% earn the luxurious amount(amount might be miserable 2k only).
Note : Only stating those mlm company start in sg
SO far i see tupperware and amway can make it only.
But u join now u also bottom. -
IronBandit, did you read up often? you seem to have experience regarding the money part
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LOL, the safest way to do mlm is i open the company and sit on the tip of pyramid with useful products at competitive prizes.
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As a matter of fact soggy89 I never liked reading but only if I have to and do selective reading and I was particularly impressed by a book my brother bought for me I think its called "The Richest Man in Babylon".
My brother set up his own company and actually he is quite there so I read and look and learn.
I think the book gives some good advice.
Baddieko... My brushes with all the MLM company was all bad be it BEL AIR, NOP or Amway. I not boosting I've rich experience but coming from a Psychological Field I then to have different view on things and see them destroy lives and stuff turns me off even if it was not that bad.
Life is full of experience and adventures some good, some bad so learn from both. and Karma is a real thing believe it... you do good, good things might not get back to you immediately but it sure gets back to you sometime.
Cheers
IronBandit -
Nice experience thought, and i like the rdpd book too, but having your same message at so many topic is too much, don't you think ?
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IronBandit - besides this NOP, you have any other experience ma?
reading the thread gives me more knowledge, but can you tell me in detail ma?
how they actually con ppl into it de ar? -
Could you give us some insights into the psychological dynamics at play during a MLM "consultation" session?
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There is not psycho dynamics play in all MLM...
These are the play that comes in
1. Friendships pressure.
2. Family Pressure
3. Crowd Pressure
4. Lots of Bullshit
5. Wonderful promises
6. Beaautiful dreams
7. long lasting money
8. Your Greed
Please all believe in a 8 to 5 job maybe a little extra time might not get you very far but it sure beats losing your money.
End of the day the money in your pocket they can't take or snatch... if you really want to be rich try saving up for a few years... just 10% of everything you are paid.
If you have a strong will and a take no shit attitude then they can never take your money away from you...
What is stopping you from standing up from your chair and walking away through the door... are they going to sue, arrest you if you walk out?
If you don't like to be "pai Sei" say go toilet and then leave if you are those that not afraid just stand up and walk out... NTI crap having a 19 yrs old tell me about doing business... feather also never grow want to teach me how to fly... Please. and doing business 5k also can do business ya... a business failure more likely...
I really pity those people that have friends in MLM and ask to join when they want to take back the cash reject here reject there...
If all these people being cheated get together and take legal action against the company see how they run... with their tails between their legs...
So ppl out there open your eyes... pop your ears to see and hear who are you friends and who are not -
You know all mlm companys are not bad, I have a downline of over 370 pple
in under a year and guess what not a single member of my family is in there or a single friend. Have they asked to be in there you bet they have but I want let them join my downline business with family and friends is bad business. The company I am with is trying to change the way network marketing is done,
by doing all the right things -
Actually halfway down your post I lost you. Can type properly or not?Originally posted by mangosteenwealth:You know all mlm companys are not bad, I have a downline of over 370 pple
in under a year and guess what not a single member of my family is in there or a single friend. Have they asked to be in there you bet they have but I want let them join my downline business with family and friends is bad business. The company I am with is trying to change the way network marketing is done,
by doing all the right things -
Mango,
I'm in no position to say if all MLM is bad but judgin from my experience those i encountered are... if your 370 has no complaints about it I think its great. So what mlm are you doing that seems to be so successful ? I would like to know if its so workable too as I do need some sideline cash.
But mango look at the burnt side of the pancake... is your last down line as successful as you? do you know him personally? do you know if he is enjoying as much as you ? If all the above is no then you might not be as successful as you think.
I'm not a guru in MLM but the basics foundation I'm pretty sure I'm quite good at it after bumping a few heads and I went all out to get my refund back. And to your surprise the franchise thing they always use to refuse you of refund don't work.
Basiscally even if you are a franchise rights holder you are entitled to your rights according to the law. So people out there thinking of joining any MLM always read the whole contract and THE FINE PRINTS thats your killer not the contract... just like ladies going to the sale that says 70% sale but the fine prints says UP TO or selected items only.... many of them always fail to read untill payment right?
Anyway I'm not condeming or condoning any MLM just a fair warning to all to be careful where you place your money. If its in your pocket they can't reach out to grab.
Cheers
IronBandit -
i think being successful is easy because we are our own masters.
to hard thing is always to help and mentor others to be successful or even more successful than you, just like being a school teacher. when the student is not willingly to listen and accept, there is nothing that the teacher can do.
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Like I tell my leaders in my organization you take a step I will take a step but I wont do it for you, you have to meet me in the middle
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My downline is loving what they are doing and I have made alot of great friends working with these people and talk to a lot of them on the telephoneOriginally posted by IronBandit:Mango,
I'm in no position to say if all MLM is bad but judgin from my experience those i encountered are... if your 370 has no complaints about it I think its great. So what mlm are you doing that seems to be so successful ? I would like to know if its so workable too as I do need some sideline cash.
But mango look at the burnt side of the pancake... is your last down line as successful as you? do you know him personally? do you know if he is enjoying as much as you ? If all the above is no then you might not be as successful as you think.
I'm not a guru in MLM but the basics foundation I'm pretty sure I'm quite good at it after bumping a few heads and I went all out to get my refund back. And to your surprise the franchise thing they always use to refuse you of refund don't work.
Basiscally even if you are a franchise rights holder you are entitled to your rights according to the law. So people out there thinking of joining any MLM always read the whole contract and THE FINE PRINTS thats your killer not the contract... just like ladies going to the sale that says 70% sale but the fine prints says UP TO or selected items only.... many of them always fail to read untill payment right?
Anyway I'm not condeming or condoning any MLM just a fair warning to all to be careful where you place your money. If its in your pocket they can't reach out to grab.
Cheers
IronBandit
on a weekly basis and the others via email on a weekly basis as well its all about relationship building, and looking for the right people -
Great Job then Mango hope you will make it big...
the 500million you helped the company make over the 3 years any chance they are sharing you the profit with after they earned it?
LOL by they way with the size of turn over the company should get listed and give share options to you all and make you guys rich seriously...Originally posted by mangosteenwealth:My downline is loving what they are doing and I have made alot of great friends working with these people and talk to a lot of them on the telephone
on a weekly basis and the others via email on a weekly basis as well its all about relationship building, and looking for the right people -
Come on guys i didn't request for private message we are adults we can chat openly right?
Mangosteenwealth here posted me a private message:
The company that I am working with is Xango a 3 year old company that did 50 million first year 150 million 2nd year 500 million 3 year it is the fastest growing company of all time in mlm also the way the pay plan works is that it promotes team work the more you help the people below you the more money you are going to make. Alot of people that join the company are just in it for the product because the product is truely amazing and has tons of reaserch behind it we just get people the info and let them decide for themselves thats it. the company offers a 30 day money back on the product so really they get to try the product free for a month I have only ever had 1 person ask for a refund and the company
gave them back their money no ? asked for more info on what it is that I do got to my website www.xgonow.biz and leave your info and take the video tour.Also where abouts are you from?
I replied :
Dear Mango,
What ever the reasons for your support or against the MLM I'm ok with anything as its your opinion and thought but all of us have different experience and things we come across. For all I know how many percent of the 500 Million did you get? Did it even offer to share each person 0.1 % or even 0.01% that would work out to 500k and 50k respectively... I think NOT!
I applaud you for your support for the company but I believe there are a lot more to it then how much they turn over anyway its all claims if its suppose to be that amount of turn over it should be listed and each of the people to be given share options after all you all help built it?
Nevertheless I love the discussion sorry for the late reply though.
The MLM - from Amway, Bel Air, No.1 Product
Cheers
Mangosteenwealth reply:
If the Company did that then it wouldn't be mlm then would it ever heard the saying to many cheifs and not enough indians what the company does do though is have a global bonus pool and 3% of all world wide sales goes into this pool every three months and is then divided amongst the premiers now thats pretty cool you know if your out of singapore they will be launching that country in about 2 weeks you could check it out yourself just let me know and I will give you the corprate address if you like.
then comes another Amzazu with his agreement to mango...
By the way how much money your company make this year?
How much bonus you getting?
6 months or more? You are worth more, you need to find out from Mango..
You want to be healthy study the healthy, dont study the sick....
for goodness sake 3 % the structure of the MLM is like Bel Air.... too many to say. end of the day they make 500 million bakarus and take 15 million to share... u kidding me and on the top (premiers) get it again. so when will those not so premiers get the share when all the premiers is shake leg and get paid....
Everyone here has eyes to read even mango agree only the premiers gets paid the bonus. so how ? we all the not so premiers suck thumb and drool huh? they work just as hard or even harder than those premiers for the company right?
Therefore I still take my stand that MLM is not a very good market or prospect for people if you are not prepared to suck some thumb and pop eyes at other people's check.
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Also its not true if it goes listed for its product its MLM network could still function as its the sales team is generating the money for the company to produce more product to sell? getting listed and selling in a network structure are two different things but able to co exist. The reason i suspect they don't ever go listed is that the turnovers are not as much as they claim. If not news paper would have interview the big bosses... just my suspeculations only don't bomb me with words or criticism.
never the less if the product is great and affordable MLM should be the right way to market i agree up to this much.
Cheers
Happy Deepavali and Hari Raya Puasa -
Hi i would like to comment on something from your replies.
Why must a MLM company go listed ? If you know well, when you are listed, eg usana your company will also depends on those shareholders, and everyone wants to make money, esp those shareholders, in this case the company have to fulfill the shareholders profit gain and also agents bonus ? If the company no need to fulfill shareholder profit gain, then only they can let agents gain more. An example will be amyway, can you say that amway is not earning alot ? Then why isn't it listed ?
Btw way, you are saying in bel air, those top people will also earn the 3% of turn over pool right, and why those at bottom can't get it too.
Then let me ask u something ? If a company CEO gain the company turn over, thats means a AA of the company also can get ? I am not refering to the profit sharing given yearly by some companies, but refering to the comments make by you.
Its can't be the same like even a General manager can't get the pool for CEO and board of directors.
Those top people work hard to get to the top too, do you think its easy to get up? My answer is very simple, if you want get something work for it. if you want earn profit like those top people, work hard and join their rank, then u can earn too. And how you know those at the top nv work harder than those at bottom ? Can you tell me a AA and a CEO which work harder ?
This world is like this, usually those starter will be earning more. Just like a franchiser and franchisee, most of the time is franchiser earning more than a franchisee right. -
I must commetn about you replies too in this case.
Up front these so called company is not MLM as they set up smaller subsidary to make way for their MLM and my saying of getting listed is a figure of speech. True enough the shareholders profit gain is important when its listed but come to think of it who will be the shareholders? Still the same gang of "business" people? true enough everyone wants to make money but gaining more from not letting the shareholder gain profit. Who are you kidding? These MLM profiles the top man earns like mad by shaking leg and giving talks like the money is so easy to earn. Agent don't get S.hit till they hit the target. BTW how did those "top brass people made to their place' No one knows only that few people know they might be the few people that set it up and give themselves the position and sit on their fat ass and let the new comers work and they enjoy every bit of their profit.
As for your example you have to eloborate you are confusing every reader here... if amway is not earning a lot of course it can't be listed.
your quote"An example will be amyway, can you say that amway is not earning alot ? Then why isn't it listed ?"
But if you meant that amway is earning a lot and why is it not listed... That is precisely my point thank you for bringing up. I too want to know why are they not listed.... after all their products flow through out the world and everyone and anyone uses them.
Then you ask me if the CEO gaint he company turn over the AA plays its part didn't her/him for sorting documents for the project handling calls and enquire or a tender. She gets a certain percentage right? at times after a certain years of hard work these are rewarded by share options to them so what is so wrong about my comments. Are you a CEO / AA either way if you are the boss or the worker you would want more for you pocket, unless you are magmaninous in nature I highly doubt so.
True enought not all GM can have the same share of CEO / board members but at least he gets a share no doubt?
You also said those top people work really hard to get to the top? How you know, you worked with them you started off together with them but their sales was better than yours? Come on we all don't the facts I can have my own assumptions right? as for your AA and CEO who work harder if you want the truth the AA he/she has lots of shelfing, documentation and paperwork.. the CEO have lunch over company's budget. use his mouth most of the time only time he uses his hands is signing contracts who prepare the contracts, documentation?? I leave it to you and the rest of the people to ponder. And at the end of the day who still gets the larger share of the profit? CEO / AA?
But one thing i do agree with you totally and from there i can stand with you on that point. Want something work for it!
Don't ask people to spend their life savings to join your so called business model and create a false dream that you can earn millions and tons of money.
Empty promises and talks that talk nothing about a business model that is similar to pyramid model just labelled different. Network marketting, multi level marketing all is the same people want to kid themselves and others so they labelled it differently and tell you its different. Example an apple from Japna and China yes they are labelled differently but what is the base fruit name APPLE.
With that said I hope you have an idea where I'm coming from as MLM is nothing more but a scam to me as I feel cheated the moment I step in to their briefing... same for every MLM company no doubt thier product is different and start up capital are very much different.
Great discussion LegacyMan you must be a MLM lover / the top brass person. But frankly I do envy people sitting on the top position, they spend like everyday sitting on their Ass and give talks at night to average man/woman and hope one of his downlink's downlink's downlinks would close a deal.
Hope to hear for you again -
I dun agree that top people just sit there and wait for money to come in from the new comers, as i really see top people helping the new comers by closing sales and pass to them and helping them to close sales even late at night. Maybe you can say they want to earn money too, thats why he work so hard, but we can't deny that the new comer benefits too right.
Frankly Amyway is the biggest MLM company in the world, if he want to earn more money, he can jolly well go listed but he did not as it will affect the agents earning.
Those share options mentioned by you are call profit-sharing bonus and sadly to say not all company have this. Not to mentioned MLM companies.
In fact you already mentioned that Its your own assumptions that the top people never work hard to get to the top. I have started with my fren in a MLM company before and he worked very hard for it, while i did not, thats why he is now at the top, but i am still hanging.
Lastly i wish to know whether you tried MLM before ? Or your frens/family tried before ? Because you can't just listen to others to think a industry is bad or is a scam.
And i am not a MLM Lover or the top brass person mentioned by you. In fact i am not really involved in it like i used to be. I only considered it as my other source of income.
And i really wishes to tell you do not judge a book by its cover, as you really need to read its content to know its stories.
I hope this discussion will not turn into a flaming session.
Cheers and great discussion ~ -
Frankly, we have our own experience and if you have read my start of the thread I've been through a few MLM company and most of them are not what they say they are. I don't believe in flaming up after all this is only discussion.
With that I think in my opinion all MLM are crap. Who are the first few people get sucked into after you? your family, relative then your friends?
Also to make you join they come up with ideas like discount on joining fee... blah blah blah... what ever the case it is its has always been crap to me.
I am frank with my friends when they ask me to go listen. I'm not joining don't try to psycho me to join cause if you do that the only thing you get if you try that stunt is never to hear from me again even if we were the best of friends so if you still want to remain friends don't discuss MLM or your company to me.
Its that simple. No means No.. even if you have on dozen people around me trying to psycho me.
Worst case senario, I walk up and go to my car and drive off.
I believe my view are pretty correct and my experience did pay off from NOP - amway - Bel Air - NTI
I can't ask you to see from my eyes but let me just ask you how much do you think you have wasted and I've wasted like 5-6k on all these bullSh.it but end of the day i learnt my lesson and I hope people that are not ready to learnt it like i do have a chance to put their money in their pocket and not pour it into these so call business that these MLM claims they are helping people setup.
Anyway happy holidays -
As long as both of us are cool, i guess this discussion wun be turned into flaming session.
I agree with you that some MLM companies really does not act what they say, but as i say there is also companies that will. How the company is like will depends greatly on how the management of the company educate their agents.
Frankly speaking i did not approach all of my frens and family members, but even though i look for them and told them about MLM, though some nv joined, but we are still as closed as before. I guess thats because i nv use those psycho tactics you mentioned.
I am not sure where you hear about this discount fee but i have not hear of them so far, those much be lying i believed.
I believed if you best of fren introduce something to you, you should really just take a look why your best fren is so into it, and understand about it and not just stay away from him just because he is from MLM, its really not fair to him.
Lastly i have not wasted money in MLM before, because usually i would have earned back, and i would like to say this again.
Please do not sink all boat just because something bad happened on one or few of them, there is still a few good boats around.
Happy Belated holidays too
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I'm cool legacyMan, no way getting flamed over a discussion that is not important.
But so far my exp with those MLM that approach me has never been good or near good. but since you have a good experience that's great news. But the discounting thingy is true happen before when they try to pester you to join them. Bel Air i remember when they wanted me to cut some cake, from 16k worth of items they offered 12k. U kidding a small kid but if they are the poor small kid wouldn't have 12k to cut a cake.
Nah all's cool with my friends as well cause I am a frank and direct person I don't like to have long talks and chit chats over something I'm not interested in. So my friends know me like that as well so they know when i say no means no and usually i wouldn't ponder over the same topic too long.
As for sinking boats its not that easy to do it but if it needs to be sunk it should wouldn't you agree?
CheersOriginally posted by LegacyMan:As long as both of us are cool, i guess this discussion wun be turned into flaming session.
I agree with you that some MLM companies really does not act what they say, but as i say there is also companies that will. How the company is like will depends greatly on how the management of the company educate their agents.
Frankly speaking i did not approach all of my frens and family members, but even though i look for them and told them about MLM, though some nv joined, but we are still as closed as before. I guess thats because i nv use those psycho tactics you mentioned.
I am not sure where you hear about this discount fee but i have not hear of them so far, those much be lying i believed.
I believed if you best of fren introduce something to you, you should really just take a look why your best fren is so into it, and understand about it and not just stay away from him just because he is from MLM, its really not fair to him.
Lastly i have not wasted money in MLM before, because usually i would have earned back, and i would like to say this again.
Please do not sink all boat just because something bad happened on one or few of them, there is still a few good boats around.
Happy Belated holidays too -
Yeah ~ I guess you have your point of view too, and its great that you are willing to share with us
I am not sure about BelAir's discount thing, but maybe that time is an promotion ? I also dunno.
Anyway as I say MLMs is suitable for everyone, but not everyone is suitable for MLM, This is the point why MLM is such a hot topic even til now ~
Just like in exam, some pass some fail, and definately those who say that exam is good is those passed and those say bad is those failed -
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